Thursday, March 05, 2009

Holy Crap (Yet Again)

So anyhoo …
This is carrying on from yesterday, so the easily bored amongst you can skip the whole damned thing and go do something useful like trash your TVs and put up bookshelves instead.
I mean it.
Go do that.
Now!

In yesterday's post and comments discussion we discovered that England - especially my own part of the country - is indeed a Godless place, and we wondered why and came to a few conclusions.

As Robyn and Shan have been making it abundantly clear to me for years now and as Mme B. pointed out yesterday, we Godless Heathens of Norfolk are kind of bucking the trend.
In the US (or at least the middle bits) and other places across the globe there has been a surge in religious fervour, most notably in Christian, Muslim and Hindu communities.

While some rejoice in this as a resurgence of faith I am saddened as it seems that the new fervour is of a fundamentalist nature, and as such is a form of religious extremism that regards itself as the sole arbiter of TRUTH and all others as WRONG!

This is not what Christ taught us.

Not that I am against fundamentalist thought; indeed I consider it necessary to the growth of any ideology, but like any other form of extremism it should be there to drive ideas and NEVER to dictate to people.

I've written about this before - at tedious length - and here's a little recap (a response to a Christian friend blaming a terrorist attack on Islam) which I consider needs reading again by anyone who welcomes the rise in evangelical Christianity, radical Islam or Hindu nationalism:

"I believe in the necessity of extremism.
Let me clarify that a little.
In politics - as in art and music and indeed religion - everything worthwhile and interesting happens out on the edges.
It takes a while before the sharp edges get worn down and bits begin to spiral down toward the plughole in the middle.
Left.
Right.
It matters not a jot.
It is the radical ideas that drive politics, religion and society forward.
Those ideas in the raw would scare the crap out of the general electorate / congregation / population but they get dulled and denuded over time and eventually reach close enough to the centre to become policy.

First off: Left and right.
I'm a Marxist. Lifelong and committed.
If you want to pigeonhole me, I'm just a smidgeon to the left of Anarcho-Syndicalism.
That's about as far left as you can get without falling off the edge.

But …
I often find myself agreeing with the extreme right and would far rather sit and talk politics over a few beers on my Republican friend Prudence's patio than listen to one word of wishy-washy, beige, insipid, compromised tosh from the muddy pit of ignorance that is "the centre".
Give me a radical rightist over a "liberal" any day.

Now …
Islam.

You all know by now that I will accept criticism of Islam.
But only from someone who has read and understood the Qur'an (preferably in Tarif Khalidi's utterly beautiful new translation) and the Life of The Prophet and has learned about Islamic prayer, visited mosques and discussed Islam with Muslims.
I have said this so many times, people:
Study the source material. Do NOT simply listen to what somebody says about it (including me). They will have applied their own spin/agenda to their comments.
Read the source material and make up your own damn minds. It's what your brain is there for.

I will NOT allow criticism of a certain colour by a blind person.

Islam means Surrender To God's Will.
The same God of Abraham that is worshipped by Jewish and Christian communities.

Islam is a tolerant religion.
"There is no compulsion in religion" states The Prophet in Sura 2 of The Qur'an.

Islamic prayer (as opposed to "greedy" Christian prayer that actually presumes to ask God for favours - a sickeningly arrogant act that I've never understood and a stale, stinky hangover from the days of the sale of indulgences … stop it, people!) is simply praise and thanks to God for His creation.

Here we return to extremism.
As I have said, I believe in the necessity of extremism.
However … and this is a big however …
We extremists should never, EVER be allowed to assume power.

A single, extreme ideology in power gave us Hitler, Stalin, Mao, and gives us General Tanh Shwe, the Taleban, Robert Mugabe, the Janjouid in Darfur and the Lord's Resistance Army in The Congo.

I equate any extremist religious group (and yes I'm afraid, Shan, that includes American Christian fundamentalists) as necessary but potentially dangerous.
Islamic extremists (a tiny minority) have gained control in some parts of the world with disastrous consequences.
I dread the rise in power of US Christian fundamentalism (what I have termed the American "Christian Taleban") as I see its growing influence on government eroding individual freedoms at an alarming rate in the same way that the Taleban did in Afghanistan when they were still a minor group of religious scholars.

In conclusion, what we need is BALANCE, not COMPROMISE.
Unfortunately we all too often get a fudged compromise on important issues.

The idea of a balance between Prudence's Republican ideals and my own Socialist ones stimulates me far more than the political mush of centrist compromise that is our de facto western political system.

A balance between the three major Abrahamic monotheistic religions is desperately needed in the world right now.
Please do not let what should be informed debate degenerate into mere petty mudslinging.

A balance of extremes is far healthier than a compromise.
A compromise will never solve the issues and will leave those on the edges embittered.
This seems to be where we are at this moment of the world."

So anyhoo … This rise in religious fervour that seems to be gripping every part of the planet except the bit where I live seems to me to be a dangerously divisive development, especially given the warlike tendencies of those three religions, currently happily killing one another all across the Middle East and through Pakistan into India.
Add militant Judaism into the mix (and a reminder to the Israeli government that your nation is founded on laws that include prominently the instruction :Thou Shalt Not Kill) and it's little wonder that the planet appears to be heading straight to Hell on a handcart.

Evangelical Christianity, Radical Islam, Hardline Judaism and Hindu Nationalism are necessary parts of those religions but should never be allowed to become the major voice in them.
Which is what appears to be happening today.
The lunatics are taking over the asylum.

I'm just glad I'll be dead soon.
If there's an afterlife I'm going to be so fucking angry!

15 comments:

savannah said...

go have a laugh, i'm off to a meeting , sugar! (i'll come back and read everything later) xoxoxo

Maria said...

Once again...I fucking love you, Dive.

My sisters are all mad about this book that is popular in the states called The Shack. They were upset about the "laid back" attitude about god in the book and especially because god was drawn as a black woman. I found this hilarious and admitted that I only got through half of the book because I thought it was simplistic, not because I was offended.

Another black mark on my soul, according to my sisters. One of them suggested that I go to confession soon if I wanted to see Liv in heaven.

I said that I looked much better in black than in white.

No angel robes for me, I guess.

I think we'll have great fun wherever we land. Since I have seen a ghost, I suspect there is an afterlife. I just don't think it is the one in my sister's heads. I think there is room for all of us and we all get to drink apple martinis and eat girl scout cookies all day.

Scout said...

I agree with you, Dive. Surprised? The extreme views on all sides are frightening, and I believe increasing in strength. The people in the lead would call it revival, but I'm not sure this is something needing resuscitating. This stuff comes in and goes in waves, so we'll just have to wait and see what happens.

Katherine said...

LOL! If there's and after-life, I hope it's the reincarnation I believe in. Be sure to visit me, Dive, as I will be a lilac bush for at least one lifetime. Then I will be a Canadian Goose, in which case, I might goose you.

Now...I'm curious why you think centrists are wimps but balance is not wimpy. Can you explain that contradiction? I see myself as a moderate, meaning I try to balance sets of ideas and avoid extremism which I believe, like you, is bad stuff.

I like the idea of rounding rough edges, however.

I also like what my history professor had to say about extremism. Think of beliefs as a circle. One end on the top is "liberal," working its way down to shades of liberal thought, down to "moderate" at the bottom of the circle. Then the line moves up through conservative ideas, closer to the conservative top. The two ends meet, resulting in extremism.

Katherine said...

Actually, I screwed up the motion of the circle. The right side should be conservative, the left side, liberal, if you want to get picky about it. I'd like to give you a diagram, but blogger doesn't allow for it.

dive said...

Savannah: Go enjoy your meeting. You really don't need to bother reading today's crap post. Believe me, it is boring.
xoxoxo

Hee hee, Maria. You just reminded me of a cartoon I have up on my bathrrom wall featuring a black woman as God.
I'll post it in a few minutes as an antidote to all this crap.

Apple martinis and girl scout cookies sounds like a nice balanced diet.

Robyn: I am a little surprised but then I class you as a good Christian, rather than a nutjob fundamentalist.
Let's hope you're right and this wave will subside and sanity return.

Katherine: I have a lovely white lilac bush just outside my kitchen window (actually it's a great big tree; the blossom comes in my bathroom window on the floor above).

As for balance, I'll try to explain my own visualisation a little clearer.
Imagine a flat disc with all the pretty colours you can think of around the outside. Those are the extreme ideas; fresh and new and raw. This works for politics, religion, art, music, whatever you want.
As you get closer to the centre the colours mix and mingle and get compromised, so close to the centre it is all a brownish sludge with nothing interesting going on.

Someone like you takes tow or three of the pretty colours and mixes them to make another pretty colour but one less extreme, whereas a boring conservative centrist just wants brown sludge and is happy to stagnate. To them, change or anything new and exciting is bad. And the new and exciting ideas come from the bright colours on the edge of the circle.

Anyhoo. Enough of that; what are you going to do with all those baggy clothes now? Hee hee.

Katherine said...

I totally understand now, Dive. Nice visual metaphor! I love it.

Baggy clothes...I'm going to donate them, of course. Most of them are in good shape even though I haven't been.

I actually put on clothes yesterday the I couldn't get into before. WOW! What a great feeling.

dive said...

Woohoo, Katherine! That makes me dancy-happy.

Petrea Burchard said...

Perhaps it's all right to have faith in ourselves. If God, or god, is everything, as some say, then we are connected. We are god. That doesn't mean we're always connected to that part of ourselves, but it's worth trying to find that part, the part that you're struggling to see.

The god in us doesn't need to label god as Christian, Muslim, Jew, etc. That part of us doesn't need national borders. The god in us doesn't make us self-worshippers. It is the part of us that's altruistic, intuitive, intelligent as well--connected through genetic memory to prehistoric ancestry, able to reach down through time with our thoughts and sympathize with those who came before us.

The god in us knows that God is not some bearded Guy in the Sky, handing down proclamations to the ignorant. God is not religion! Religion was created by frightened, uneducated male human beings, trying to come up with explanations for things they didn't understand and to mollify their terrified underlings.

We have science now, and science can't explain everything--yet. But one thing it teaches us is that things can be explained. Can everything be explained? Perhaps that is unknowable. But I have faith in science, and I have faith in the god in me, the one I was born with. That's the one I strive to remain close to.

Petrea Burchard said...

The weird thing is I think I might have posted that somewhere else, too. I have no idea where. eek. Or, I should say, hey ho.

dive said...

Oh, hee hee, Petrea!
Excellent! I love it.

Katherine said...

Petrea, that was incredibly eloquent. As a modern Transcendentalist, I love this: "Perhaps it's all right to have faith in ourselves. If God, or god, is everything, as some say, then we are connected. We are god."

Bravo!

Shan said...

So much to say....but it's one of those days. Between feeding the boy with a medicine dropper, x-rays, library visits, making guacamole and birthday party prep for the evening and a husband home early, there are too many distractions for proper Shan-sized comments. ;) Devie boy is much better by the way, thanks for the well wishes.

I did want to tell anonymous that I can't be that easily offended and I saw nothing of the sort in her(?) comments. If anything I am the offensive one over here! :D

I might be back later. I hate to miss such juicy topics even if your day is already over and done.

neetzy said...

Dive,
You are certainly baiting the hook with these delicious topics of God and religion. I am glad you still allow yourself to soul-search. I admire your recent perusal of the Imitation of Christ. I read that several time during the period of my life when I was very spiritual. I also read the Pilgrim's Progress and a lot of the Bible.
While I still consider myself spiritual, I do not proclaim any religion (at the moment). I have been burned by religious hypocrites who have tried to use fear to control my life and thoughts. I still have great admiration for Jesus and feel a kindred to him and his hatred of these religious hypocrites. I too miss the innocent faith of my youth. I cannot stand the holier than thou religicans that are abundant in my area. (More on a soon to come post). I could go on for hours. I admire, however, the many wonderful people I have met of many religious persuasions who live by their convictions. These people rarely proclaim that they have the monopoly on THE true faith, but acknowledge the common good in an enlightened, spiritual life.

dive said...

Katherine: I wholeheartedly concur (but then I do that with everything you say … hee hee).

Shan: Oooooh guacamole!
Sorry, but I can't resist a good, home-made mole.
I'm so glad Devie is on the mend. It sounded really painful.

Don't worry about not leaving a Shan-sized comment. I know you are on my case and live in hope that one day you will succeed in getting me to a point of revelation where it will suddenly all make sense again and I'll be back in the fold.

Neetzy: When I'm stuck on the train for hundreds of hours a month I have a lot of time for soul-searching.
The Imitation of Christ is a beautiful book and should be read and taken as inspiration by everyone, regardless of their religion.
And you are so right; luckily there are indeed millions of truly good people out there - of all faiths (and none, too) - trying their best to live good, worthwhile lives. It is just that they don't make as much noise as the Fundamentalists.
Actually, I admire my fellow Atheists the most out of all those people trying to live good lives as they are doing it with no thought of reward in any afterlife. Being good for its own sake is its own reward.